Curse

Flippy_Skreem · Aug 28, 2007, 07:42 PM // 19:42

/signed

Argreed

Miss Elvy · Aug 28, 2007, 07:56 PM // 19:56

/sign

The greatest disappointment in GW:EN as we got to preview it was definitely the HoM. I'd been looking forward to this feature, but when I finally got to see it... yeah, it sucked. Big time.

I don't mind earning my tapestries. It's good fun. It keeps me busy. I do mind not being able to have the HoM anywhere near the way I want it, or even the way all the promoting of the feature suggested it would work.

1. Fellowship. Not that this was a really interesting one to begin with, but sure, I'll display my Razah / Phoenix / whatever. Good times, until you realise that pets will have to be lvl20 and heroes need to have had armour upgrades.
Levelling a pet is a pain for most classes (I'm a Mesmer, I don't really have any use for a pet, ever) as Beast Mastery doesn't go well with most builds. Sure, I can drop 2 very useful skills for Charm and Comfort Animal, but when playing Hard Mode I do feel a certain level of responsibility towards the rest of my team to play as well as I can. Dropping two useful skills so I can level my pet does not work with that picture. Grinding my pet to level 20 is doable, but it would add to HoM becoming a Hall of Grinds.
Heroes needing armour upgrades? Wha...? I was incredibly disappointed when I saw that. I need to either play a lot of really boring Challenge Missions to get all of my heroes a set, or spend ridiculous amounts of cash on them. More farming ensues. Yay? No. Display the heroes as they are, and display the upgraded armour if someone bothered to get it. I can live with getting a lvl20 pet if the hero bit at least would be adjusted.

2. Devotion. Yay, I get to display my mini- what do you mean, I can't use my Kuunavang on any other character but this one anymore?! Need I say more? I hope not.

3. Valour. It seems a bit too selective the way it is right now. I'd like to think that I can get a really rare skin added to the Hall, or even something like my Urgoz's Longbow or some other 'high-end' green. Not necessarily for transfer to GW2, I can survive a little more selection as to what can actually be taken from HoM into GW2, but at least for GW1 display I'd like to actually be able to add some more. My Hall is just so empty this way...

4. Resilience. Woohoo! I'm displaying my Mesmer's Vabbi / FoW / whatev- why is there Paragon and Necro armour on there? Holy jeebus, ANet/NCSoft/Idon'treallycarewhosolongasitgetsfixed, there was a reason why all the armour sets were made to be equal. It was so you could pick your own look, and apply bonuses as you liked them, and not be tied to a certain look just because you wanted so or so bonus. I like to think so, anyway.
Let's be honest. We have always selected our armour sets from an aesthetic point of view- we pick the sets we can actually stomach to watch as we play, in the same way we select our character's features. If you worked hard to get your favourite character Fissure armour, you want to see that set on the pedestal. You gave your Ele/Necro/whatever FoW armour because you liked it best for that particular character. If you had preferred Paragon FoW, you'd have given your Paragon FoW and not your Warrior, for instance.
So, taking this into account... how many people would be happy to see all the sets they gathered for their favourite class be converted into sets they may not even like? I want to display my Mesmer's Vabbi, not a Paragon set that looks just as almost every other Paragon set out there for me. Heck, I'm happy with just one statue per set- I made a female Mesmer because I preferred her over her male counterparts. I'm happy to just display the female version, so long as it corresponds to my darn class.
Edit: So long as it corresponds to my darn class, and my character's gender. I love female Mesmer Vabbi. Male Mesmer Vabbi makes me cry. No, not literally. Yes, I think it matters.

5. Honour. Can someone spell PvP elitism? Snobbism? Outright disregard of the majority of GW players, perhaps? PvE has always been the neglected half of Guild Wars. Face it. Every nerf out there was based on PvP, and in some cases it has severely compromised PvE gameplay for certain classes. Even though things did get rectified here and there, overall PvE has always been held in disregard in favour of PvP. Sure, we get a few PvE-only skills, but it's not going to change the overall bitter aftertaste of every Mesmer nerf in the history of Guild Wars. What else does PvE get? A ton of titles we can gather, but none of these can be displayed. Why?
Does someone who has earned I'm Very Important or higher not deserve a statue of their own? I think they do. What about Legendary Survivors, or Legendary Defenders of Ascalon? I could go on, there are loads titles worthy of being displayed. And wouldn't it just be a hoot to see an Incorrigible Alehound statue?
I can live with having to max them out to a certain degree. Sunspear Rank 6... meh, not too impressive, but hey, a Sunspear Rank 9 deserves some credit. What about Holy Lightbringers, Legendary Vanquishers and Guardians?
I never cared much for PvP, and I never will. It's just not my kind of thing. Does this mean I shouldn't be allowed any of my many titles I've acquired? I don't think so.
Now, before anyone says 'read what the pedestal says'... I did. I read it. I'm probably the only soul who ever will. Why would a handful of PvP players be actually allowed to show, though, while the majority of GW players must settle for a measly footnote? Because that's what it is.
The Hall of Monuments is in PvE. To get there, you need to play PvE. I'm sure there will be PvP players who may just buy GW:EN for the Hall and a handful of extra skills, but the people with the greatest interest in the HoM were probably always the PvE-ers, or those who play both styles. Why then would PvE titles be excluded? And honestly... how many people are there who have actually made it to the PvP ranks required? Really not that many. Kudos to those who did, but they have titles, emotes or both already as a reward- not to mention those who owned enough to get tournament rewards. I admire them, but I really don't think the general PvP elitism needs to be promoted any further; there is more than enough of it as it is. As a primary PvE-player, I feel under-appreciated and undervalued. Apparently my hours and hours of work on Legendary Everything are not as important as the hours and hours someone else spent on rank whatever Hero. Credit where it is due, guys, but right now the game is saying that only a handful of skilled PvPers really deserve credit.

In conclusion, I feel that as it stands the HoM may as well be renamed the Hall of PvP Elitism or even, and probably more appropriately, the Hall of Disappointments. I am not going to suggest improvements, because I'd only be repeating what so many other people have already said- several great ideas that merit at least consideration if not more. Yes to customising minis to a single account, for instance, but no to sticking to the system the way it is.
While I am aware that HoM was only a sneak preview and may not have shown its full awesomeness, I can only say that as it stands it is possibly the greatest letdown in the history of Guild Wars. Hopefully it really was just a sneak preview, and we'll all see it in its full glory once GW:EN goes live.
As a player for whom the HoM will be a deciding factor in my eventual purchase (or lack thereof) of GW2, I can only continue stressing my (initial) disappointment. The monuments overall don't work this way, and I really feel that PvE players have taken too much abuse already to be forced to cope with this latest insult, even if it was unintentional.
I've always believed in ANet and NCSoft doing their best to keep their community happy as a whole, or at least doing their best for as many people as they can, but right now I'm losing my religion.

/signed, again, for emphasis.

JaiGaia · Aug 28, 2007, 07:57 PM // 19:57

/agree
as this is not final im sure and Anet will listen and appeal in the long run to the masses on most of whats being asked for. I myself was disappointed in not being able to show guardian/protector/ vanquishing titles. or even the fact of my characters alignment to kurzick title would be nice as if gw2 picks up any inheritence thatd definitely be something that ur family line would inherit. lol. Weapons allow greens and Rare skinned weapons or end games.

Imo i think that HoM should have both account based [ such as minis]and non account based within the halls its strange as GWen isnt a pvp based expansion yet its biggest monument for titles is pvp and R9 at that..huge contradiction there. i mean ik that gettin the KoAbD track would be repped in some way but what sense is it to even max that out which probably not one person with a life will do and not be able to show the different maxxed titles u got to get the title. And though theres no new storage space maybe the hall itself should be the extra storage space... like in the minis or weapons and armors u put what u dont want on a mule or carrying there if it fits the standards for that monument. Or in Rangers finally being able to have more than one pet and give our monument a stable that holds atleast 2-3 extra... overall though i like the thought the original starter of this thread had great ideas and hopefully if someones listening we ll see a few.

Mordakai · Aug 28, 2007, 08:02 PM // 20:02

I'd like to change my vote.

While I agree substantial changes need to be made, it does not need to be account based. In fact, account based would cheapen the rewards for people who worked on one character primarily.

Instead I would lessen the Title requirements to ANY maxed title, allow more options for armor display, and allow people to store their customized mini-pets in the Hall (sounds like the biggest gripe).

Green weapon unlocks would be a plus as well, but as long as I actually get some high end weapons in GWEN to display, I'll be happy.

Rayea · Aug 28, 2007, 08:07 PM // 20:07

/signed

account based....definately mist, but, why is it so improtant to get so many things tracked over to GW2?

i always thought, from what i hear/read about gw2, that most of the stuff you got in trasfer with gwen was just BRAGGING RIGHTS
you know...

a grizzled, one eyed warrior walks into the familys main hall and sits infront of the fire, proceding to tell all the kids about how great-great grandaddy Leeeroy used *THIS* sword, and *THIS* shield (which he waves about for emphasis) to defeat the BigBadd about 245 years ago...and that if they are realy good little sprots, the Nursie will take them all on a trip to the Hall of Monuments, where they can see a statue of great-great-grandad in his armor and other things. no, Johny, you cant touch them, the only things that are real are the Sword and the Shield, and they are mine, since i Passed the Test of the Scrying Pool, and was deemed WORTHY

so...what do i, the great-great-grandkid of mr Leeroy the Hero in the Hall get?
well..i get his Sword, and his Shield, slightly battered though they are, they are the *actual* wepons great-great-grampa used..not the best of weps, true, but they were *HIS* weps....what else...well, i can clame to be of his line...boast about what HE did....bost about what HE collected....

i never expected to get every single tital that any or all my chracters posessed....THEY gained the titals, not my GW2 character...same goes with the Mini's...if they are pets, then what you are storing (please, for the love of all the gw gods, let us simply place the pets in the hall for storage!) would be the likeness of the pets, they would have become fragile in the 250 years it takes to go from one game to the other.

just as the likeness of the heroes wouldnt necisarrily allow you to use all of the heroes. i mean, sheesh, gwen might look like an old hag by the time gw2 setting is, if she wasnt a pile of dust by then, so, how can i be exected to take her with me?

so, are you all saying that GW2 is 1 character per account?

okies, so we can have more than one, fine..but, shouldnt the character you want to inherit have the same surnameas the hero you want to collect from, the one with the monument?

after all...you did some damn fine work, you got many titals and achivements befor you settled down and had kids/grankids and bought the farm/bit the big one and made your way to the underworld for a well deserved rest....why the frell would you want your decendants to forget your name and choose another family name? hmm?

so..account based hall, but it dosent need to track the deleted....it only needs to trac those that actually go to the hall, at least....and i doubt if they will give ME any titals, i havent even completed a single campagne, bought a single peice of 15k+ armour...

i dont WANT/HAVE any greens to display, i might have a gold, but i dont like it now....i prefer my hourglass staff, i want THAT to go to my child/grankid in GW2....i want my decendants to see a statue of ME, their ANCESTOR in the hall, wearing the armor i wore when i did the big hero stuff....

im also dissapointed that the henchies cant be in your friends monument....*pouts* i wanted to get Claude in there, specialy considering any begeting of decendants my character (main) was planning was going to be with HIM lol...(granny, who's that miserable looking guy in the friends monument? him, oh, that great-grandady Claude, your ancestress's husband lol)

personaly, i could care less about the honour momument, since i doubt it will ever record anything of interest about Misha, what with her never being interested in PvP....

hows about you make the hall account based, but you still need to unlock the tapestries per char that you want to view the stats for....call em all memebers of the same family, but any other char on your account is a cousine...u know..my brothers child, my sisters daughter ect....related by blood, if not by name....

but to gain access to the nice,shiny stuff in GW2, you have to be a direct decendant of just ONE char....the one your surname is the same as....

(sure, you can see all your ancestors achivements, even the ones your just related to by blood, but you only inherit from direct*surnamed* ancestors)

mrmango · Aug 28, 2007, 08:16 PM // 20:16

/signed

Avatara · Aug 28, 2007, 08:20 PM // 20:20

/signed

I think Anet is making the same mistake as with the titles...

There might be more characters but it's only one player that's playing them...
So the player should be rewarded and not the characters. If rewards are character specific they kinda force you to play one character over the others. Seems kinda strange to me considering you can make 8-9 characters if you own all chapters. (ands you can even buy more slots) Why the hell would I play more than one character if I have to max a lot of titles on a single character?

EternalTempest · Aug 28, 2007, 08:30 PM // 20:30

1. Account Based
-Currently in the Preview Weekend, HoM is Character based. This concerns many players, as many players have multiple (or even half a dozen) characters that they wish to get to HoM, and upgrade enough to have some benefit in Guild Wars 2. Having a account based system would allow all of your accomplishments to be shown in one place, and NOT spread across many different Halls.

/signed

Since it's by character, I'm now only focused on one single pve character, and probable going to scrap all my other pve character so I can max her out.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

2. Monument of Devotion
-Currently, the Monument of Devotion shows statues of minipets and collectables. When you put a Minipet on display, it becomes assigned to that character and that character alone. That means if you want to use it with say for instance ANOTHER character on your account, you can't. This is a severe flaw in HoM, no doubt.
- Minipets should, or could be assigned to ACCOUNTS and not specific characters. I know as a player I wouldn't want to buy multiple sets of minipets just to show them off in my hall. Granted, I don't NEED to, but it would alot easier if I just had one place where all of my minipets were located, and this ties in with the Hall being account based.

/signed

I too want my mini-pets account based, not character based. Re-enforced the net result of #1 of only focusing on one single character

------------------------------------------------------------------------

3. The Monument of Honor
-Of all the areas in HoM, this one confounds me the most. First off, you can only display PvP titles in this area, and secondly, you have to be rank 9 or higher in that title to even show it.

This upsets many PvE players, as completion of a title includes a small paragraph description, such as completing a campaign, or getting the Kind of A Big Deal title track far along. And many HA'ers or GvGers who spend all of their time in PvP aren't even able to show their titles, because HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE RANK 9 IN CHAMPION? Not many.

/Not Signed
PvP needs acknowledgment in HoM

Chance are very high that these gw2 "unlocks" would be pvp in nature as well (which pve players won't benefit from) What your suggesting is a separate PvP HoM

------------------------------------------------------------------------

4. The Monument of Valor
- This monument displays high end weapons from GW:EN. Many players have said that it would be nice to display whatever you want, and make it a bit more customizable.

/Not Signed
I'm comfy with the fact there are 11 weapons from GW:EN - this seem like there attainable besides the very rich.
Again this is to unlocks a special something (that "set") in GW2. This is where Anet shows Skill vs Grind.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

5. The Monument of Resilience
- This monument displays ascended armors for your character...well not really. It displays the area of which you got the armor, and the type of armor it is, and then displays a sample of what the armor looks like on two random classes.
- If you spend hundreds of hours getting your Obsidian and went to display it, the last thing you would want to see is a picture of a Ritualist and his armor, instead of your own. While this flaw isn't a very big deal, it would make a whole lot more sense to simply show that characters armor, right?

/Not Signed
I rather have "Obsidian" unlock vs a Job / Obsidian "specific" unlock. The way it is know is more account based.
If they do it the way you suggested, ppl will think they need the elite set for "every" job available.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

6. Accessibility to HoM
- Instead of having to travel to Tyria, then Eye of the North, and then run into the portal for your HoM, why not just make it a sidebar on your character screen? Pressing H would bring up a bar that would say " Go to my Hall of Monuments" clicking it would instantly bring you to the hall, instead of spending more time going to portal after portal. This feature would be similiar to the Player Rank bar, and Hero battles.

/Signed
Just make it so they they can't leave the HoM if you travel by this method.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

7.Upgrades in HoM
- Title says it all. In addition to making HoM account based, adding fun NPC's for you to buy would not only be a money sink, but would be great for those who are guildless, or just want a Xunlai agent where ever they go.

/Not sure = I have enough grinding as it is for armor.

philler · Aug 28, 2007, 08:32 PM // 20:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

I'd like to change my vote.

While I agree substantial changes need to be made, it does not need to be account based. In fact, account based would cheapen the rewards for people who worked on one character primarily.

Instead I would lessen the Title requirements to ANY maxed title, allow more options for armor display, and allow people to store their customized mini-pets in the Hall (sounds like the biggest gripe).

Green weapon unlocks would be a plus as well, but as long as I actually get some high end weapons in GWEN to display, I'll be happy.

i totally agree with what he says.

Brofex · Aug 28, 2007, 08:37 PM // 20:37

/signed

agree

Relentless · Aug 28, 2007, 08:39 PM // 20:39

I was looking forward to the HoM....boy was I let down....hope to see some changes in the future.

/signed

Erinya Gallowdawn · Aug 28, 2007, 08:41 PM // 20:41

/agree

I am NOT happy with the Monument of Honor giving the briefest overview of my characters accomplishments when I have spent so much time working on them, only to indicate that the majority of that effort is wasted since it wasn't spent in arenas.

I agree that it would be nice for heroes to be shown regardless, and heroes with armor upgrades have that upgrade shown.

I agree that the character armor sets need to accurately reflect at least the class of the character and preferably the gender as well.

I agree that the Monument of Valor needs to have a broader criteria for display. It bothers me greatly that the rare, the valuable and the incredibly useful weapons from Prophecies, Factions and Nightfall are ignored.

Where I disagree enough with the initial proposals in this thread so that I'm unable to "sign", is that I have no problem with mini-pets being customized, and I have no desire for the hall to be account wide.

xarchitect · Aug 28, 2007, 08:46 PM // 20:46

/signed

and /signed again for good measure because changes must be made.

geriand · Aug 28, 2007, 09:20 PM // 21:20

/signed again

can someone PM a link of this to the GW peeps on this forum like Gaile Grey so that they can pass it onto the peeps who can do something about it

Jongo River · Aug 28, 2007, 09:22 PM // 21:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

While I agree substantial changes need to be made, it does not need to be account based. In fact, account based would cheapen the rewards for people who worked on one character primarily.

Ooh, I hate the cheapen argument. It always boils down to "I was willing to do this, so everyone else should have to". Seriously, why should a player who has focused on one character be rewarded more highly than one who prefers to use several? It makes no sense.

Look at these "rewards" as what they are - encouragement to buy GW2 when it comes out. As far as I'm concerned, no one should be expected to work very hard for them.

trigger20 · Aug 28, 2007, 09:36 PM // 21:36

/signed

i never write on these things and this is my first and it is worth it, please change the HoM. It sucks and i am so let down by it

i have had enough of gw and this seems to be the last straw for this player of many years if this is what it has come to. A BIG LET DOWN!!!! then i won't be seeting myself up for the same failure of guild wars 2

i will wait for the release of GW:EN but i feel i will be moving to another game

trigger20 · Aug 28, 2007, 09:37 PM // 21:37

P.S.

my room mate said she wants to sign to

so ner

Dunge · Aug 28, 2007, 09:37 PM // 21:37

/signed

Argreed

Blackheart56 · Aug 28, 2007, 10:22 PM // 22:22

/signed but the whole drag about hom is that its char based. i was really hoping for account based since i dont do pvp at all. oh well it was nice weekend but the hom really drag it down the crapper

Leslie · Aug 28, 2007, 10:43 PM // 22:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by trigger20

/signed

i never write on these things and this is my first and it is worth it, please change the HoM. It sucks and i am so let down by it

i have had enough of gw and this seems to be the last straw for this player of many years if this is what it has come to. A BIG LET DOWN!!!! then i won't be seeting myself up for the same failure of guild wars 2

i will wait for the release of GW:EN but i feel i will be moving to another game

first off the HoM is only a part of GW:EN. There are many other reasons to get the game, and many other games don't offer the ability to carry over acomplishments from one to the other; so really any form of HoM seems beneficial to me. I also do not currently like HoM, but I'm positive what we saw was not the completed version and some changes will be made. It's best to be patient, see what they do to it on release and hopefully Gaile or somesuch will be able to give us some more information about future changes planned to HoM.